Contemporary Conflicts Demonstrate Value of Unmanned Systems in Future Warfare

Asked about lessons learned from conflicts or tension in Ukraine, Israel, the Red Sea, the Gulf of Aden and the South China Sea, a panel of U.S. Navy and Marine Corps officials at the AFCEA International 2025 West conference stressed the value of unmanned systems, robotics, electronic warfare and information warfare.

The panel, which explored whether warfare community leaders are able to advance operational capabilities, included the Navy Vice Adm. Robert Gaucher, who commands  Naval Submarine Forces, Submarine Force, U.S. Atlantic Fleet and Allied Submarine Command; Rear Adm. Milton Sands, commander, Naval Special Warfare Command; Vice Adm. Daniel Cheever, commander, Naval Air Forces and Naval Air Force, Pacific Fleet; Vice Adm. Michael Vernazza, commander, Naval Information Forces; Vice Adm. Brendan McLane, commander, Naval Surface Forces and commander, Naval Surface Force, Pacific Fleet; along with Marine Corps Lt. Gen. Eric Austin, commanding general, Marine Corps Combat Development Command and deputy commandant for combat development and integration. Retired Vice Adm. Peter Daily, former CEO and publisher, U.S. Naval Institute, moderated the discussion.

McLane kicked off the discussion with lessons learned from the Red Sea, talking about the decision-making cycle known as the observe, orient, decide, act (OODA) loop. He described a complex but rapid chain of events, communications and data-sharing any time a Navy ship is involved in an operation. That chain allows initial feedback within 48 hours to the ship’s crew and more in-depth lessons learned in a matter of days. Ultimately, the lessons learned are integrated into the curriculum at various Navy schools.

“In the past, it took us 40 days or more to complete that loop. The ship would have to pull in. We would have to download it on tapes. The tapes would have to get handwalked all the way to Dahlgren,” McLane recalled. “The satellite connectivity that we have now enables us on every baseline to be able to do that download.” He said he is very impressed with where the Navy is now.

Gaucher pointed out that the United States has no real submarine presence in the Red Sea or Black Sea, but from Ukraine lessons learned, he stressed the importance of unmanned systems and the importance to “get those systems in the water and try things.” Of the Ukrainians, he said, “They’re failing fast, they’re learning fast, they’re finding ways to take these systems, piece them together, put together whatever [concept of operations] they can and get some amount of results. I think that’s a good model for us as we look to drive more lethality and more operations with our unmanned systems.”

Cheever reported that expeditionary forces, P-8 forces and MQ-4 unmanned systems are in high demand around the globe, and he added cooperation and interoperability with allies and partners are the key to future success.

“Simultaneously, we’re doing the Red Sea piece, we’re assisting in the Ukraine piece of it, and we’re doing South China Sea. So, we’re preserving the peace, we’re responding in crisis and winning decisively in combat all simultaneously, all around the globe. If that’s not a key takeaway, I’m not sure I’m following the music right."

Earlier in the discussion, Cheever responded to a question about preparing for 2027 by promising the Boeing MQ-25 Stingray aerial refueling drone will fly soon. “We will fly the MQ-25 in [20]25. You can quote me on that. We will fly that platform in ’25 and get that thing on a carrier in ’26 and start integrating that thing. That unlocks the future of manned-unmanned teaming,” which he noted is the second priority in the Navy’s navigation plan. “We’re going after that thing hard so that we can do manned-unmanned teaming in a big way off an aircraft carrier, and that is a different world. It opens up the future sixth-gen, collaborative combat aircraft and everything that comes after it.”

Austin noted the need to field counter-unmanned aerial systems (UAS) technologies. The Marines are fielding four counter-UAS capabilities, everything from dismounted systems to mobile systems and installation defense systems. “But fielding is not enough, ladies and gentlemen. Fielding them is a hardware solution, and we have to continue to iterate and improve the software. He added that the sailors and Marines who operate the systems will be the ones teaching the services how best to use them.

Vernazza highlighted the importance of the electronic warfare (EW) environment. “The EW environment is dynamic, robust and adaptive. We will have to be more dynamic, robust and adaptive in operating in that environment going forward, certainly in a peer competitor situation.”

He also praised the information warfare teams as having done “a tremendous job in terms of understanding the environment, being able to characterize the environment” for the “surface folks, the air teams and the undersea teams,” and relaying that knowledge in a way that provides for positive results.

Sands noted the need for agility in naval surface warfare. “Agility, when we look at where we’re going, that’s the big theme.” He echoed McLane’s remarks on international allies and partnerships and interoperability. The third “theme” he mentioned from a naval surface warfare perspective is to “embrace the robots.”

“We right now have areas where machine-on-machine fighting is taking place, and there are areas of the Earth where humans cannot survive. Manned-unmanned teaming is the future,” Sands declared.

Multiple panelists also cited the importance of live, virtual and constructive training. Vernazza, for example, touted the need for such training at the top secret and secret compartmented information, as well as special access programs. “Much of what information warfare needs to do has to be done not in an open environment where the adversaries can see and collect, so building out that [live, virtual and constructive] infrastructure is one of our main goals for 2025."
 

WEST is co-hosted by AFCEA International and the U.S. Naval Institute. SIGNAL Media is the official media of AFCEA International.